Grusch, Fravor, and Graves to testify at House UAP Hearing

They’ve announced the witnesses for the House Oversight Committee’s UAP hearing, including whistleblower David Grusch as well as Navy pilots David Fravor and Ryan Graves. Several Congresspeople are hopping mad about being denied access to videos and whistleblowers during a visit to Elgin Air Force Base, and they’re making it clear that the upcoming hearing is a direct effort by Congress to confront ongoing Pentagon interference in their UFO investigation. It’s clear Congress knows more than they’re saying… Could it be the reason they’re pushing so hard is because they already have smoking gun evidence?

House UAP Hearing

Rep. Burchett: “Last year, the House Intelligence Committee held a hearing on UAPs. They brought in some Pentagon bureaucrats who only had two answers to the questions they were asked: ‘I don’t know,’ or ‘That’s classified.’ This hearing is going to be different. We’re going to have witnesses who can speak frankly to the public about their experiences.”
Witnesses announced:
- Rt. Commander David Fravor, former fighter pilot and Commanding Officer of the U.S. Navy’s Black Aces Squadron
  - Witness to 2004 USS Nimitz “Tic Tac” incident (FLIR video)
- Ryan Graves, former fighter pilot and Executive Director of the advocacy organization Americans for Safe Aerospace
  - Witness to 2014 USS Theodore Roosevelt incident (Gimbal & Gofast videos)
- David Grusch, UAP whistleblower, former National Reconnaissance Office and National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency employee who was a representative to the UAP Task Force (UAPTF)
Rep Burchett: “Decorated veterans. These people — why would they risk their reputations and careers over something that they’re lying about? It’s just — it’s too big right now, and I don’t believe they can keep their thumb in the dam too much longer, because people are coming forward at too rapid of a rate.”
Rep. Moskowitz: “Myself, Representative Burchett, and Representative Gaetz had attended an Air Force base and we were blocked not only by the Pentagon but by the Department of the Air Force from seeing information, talking to witnesses. After much arm twisting we got some of the information.”
Rep. Luna: “If the Department of the Air Force, if the Pentagon thinks that they’re above Congress, they have something else coming to them. We told them we are going to [hold hearings] if they continue to hide information…”
Rep. Moskowitz: “The fact is that [the Pentagon] answers to Congress and thus to the American people. And any government entity that attempts to stonewall us is doing nothing in the invested interests of the American people. When I take the face value of the numerous road blocks that we have been presented with it leads me to believe that they are indeed hiding information.”
Rep Luna: “What Rep. Burchett, myself and my colleagues behind me have realized is that, ultimately, as elected members assigned to House Oversight and Accountability, we can conduct field hearings, and if we continue to get stonewalled, if we smell that they are giving us a bunch of BS, we are going to do the field hearings directly at those locations, and we’re going to open it up to the press because full transparency is really what we need in this situation….The military, the Pentagon, the intelligence agencies, they answer to the people and thus Congress, and so we are going to hold them accountable.”

Pentagon Harassed Witnesses, NASA Backed Down

Rep. Burchett: “They tried to block it—staff tried to block it. Everybody tried to block it. That’s not the job of staff of the so-called intelligence community. It’s the job of the committee. Also, the Pentagon has flexed their muscle. We’ve lost a witness because of that, and NASA has backed down.”
Rep. Burchett: “We’ve had witnesses that have backed out on us and have told us that they received, ‘inquiries’ I guess you could say, from the Pentagon. And so obviously we’re over the target, and they know it, and that’s why they’re firing at us. And if there isn’t anything, then why the push to cover it up?”
NASA response: “NASA was not requested to participate in the United States House Committee’s hearing on UAP. David Spergel, president of the Simons Foundation and chair of NASA’s UAP Independent Study, was invited but declined to attend, since the work of the independent study team is not due to be completed until later in the coming weeks.”

“Intelligence Community” (didn’t) block Burchett’s bill

Rep. Burchett: “If UFOs and UAPs don’t exist why is the “intelligence community” blocking my amendment? And, how do they have the power to block it?”
Rep. McGovern: “What are you talking about? It wasn’t the “intelligence community,” you voted to block YOUR OWN amendment.”
Rep. Burchett: “This amendment wasn’t even given a vote in Rules. No one had a chance to vote on this amendment.”
Rep. McGovern: “You submitted an amendment, and then you voted for a Rule that blocked your own amendment. That’s why no one had a chance to vote on it.”
Rep. Burchett: “You clearly said I voted against my own amendment. That’s incorrect and misleading.”
Reddit: “What is likely the case here is that the committee said ‘We’re voting on the bill as is, no more amendments’ and Burchett voted aye. There are likely many things that Burchett wanted passed in the main bill, even without his amendment being considered. From a certain point of view, both Burchett and McGovern are correct in their framing of what happened (‘My amendment was never considered!’ vs. ‘You voted to accept the bill without your amendment!’).”

The Elgin AFB Trip

After the UFO shootdowns over Canada and Alaska in February, Congressional trip was organized to Elgin AFB to see footage and speak to witnesses.
Rep Burchett: “We contacted the Air Force and were told we were going to be briefed on the issue. We got down there and it was the traditional stuff, but it didn’t have anything to do with the UFO and we stopped the thing right in the middle of it and said, ‘hey, this is not what you told us we were coming down for and he basically told us ‘we’re not going to give it to you.’ The arrogance of this general was beyond belief.”
- In an interview: “I was denied footage. We were told there was going to be footage and a secure briefing. And that it was very clear that it was undeniable what it was, and you could actually see the structure up close. And then when we got there, we were denied that. And then they brought in the pilots, and you could tell the spooks in the room, the CIA or whoever they were, were very nervous over what they were saying to us. And I felt like maybe they were suppressed over what they could speak.”
Rep. Luna: “”Ultimately what ended up happening is we had to call House Armed Services, Chairman Rogers got involved, the Pentagon got involved, the Department of the Air Force got involved, and we actually got into an argument with the General of that base. And it’s important to note that we were there simply to follow up on the whistleblowers that came forward with information… We had a pilot there who was going to be [testifying in the hearing] who was denied access.”
Pentagon response: “Eglin Air Force Base supported a visit from Representatives Gaetz, Burchett, and Luna on Feb 21. Air Force officials provided a classified briefing on intelligence collection threats to Eglin Air Force Base during their visit. The Congressmembers halted the briefing and requested instead a briefing focused on Unidentified Aerial Phenomena. Base officials responded to present additional available classified information on UAPs to all three members but were only able to discuss a certain portion of the information with Representative Gaetz, a member of the House Armed Services Committee. Representatives Burchett and Luna, not being members of a congressional defense committee, did not possess the access required to join the portion of the discussion reserved for Representative Gaetz.”
Rep. Luna: “The level of backtracking and attempt at saving face from the Pentagon, DOD, and USAF is unreal. My office specifically reached out to ask Eglin AFB for a briefing for the other members who will be at the hearing this upcoming week (to include Democrats) on UAP’s and they denied that request and offered to brief us on space force instead. An Air Force General, nor does the Pentagon, decide what level of clearance is acceptable for a member of Congress to receive a briefing on UAP’s. Especially ones on oversight and accountability (over the entire US Government). I have the adequate clearance and the statement from Eglin AFB is a half truth as to what really happened.”
Rep. Gaetz, back in March: “I have seen evidence of craft that I am not familiar with any of our allies or adversaries or even our country possessing. I’ve seen that craft taken by air crews who have gotten quite close to it and we’ve got a lot more questions about why this information isn’t more broadly available to the American people,”
- Rep. Burchett, shown that clip now: “Sure, I was with Matt, I know what he’s referring to.”

Reactions

Mainstream media coverage is picking up this week: Wall Street Journal , ABC News , CNN , Newsweek , Politico , The Hill ,
Mick West: “I was correct [regarding the witnesses at the hearing being pilots]. So Fravor and Graves have already told their story countless times. Grusch is not a firsthand witness. People have told him stuff. Unless he’s going to name names (and hangers), then what are we going to get from this hearing?”
Gaël Lombart, science journalist at Le Parisien: “Since David Grusch’s story came out, I’ve been a little bit surprised by an assertion: ‘This is hearsay’, ‘second hand info’. I am one of the few journalists to have interviewed him so far. I must say that it doesn’t seem so clear. When I asked David Grusch ‘Have you seen any material yourself’, he answered: ‘I have seen very interesting things that I am not allowed to speak publicly about quite yet. I do not have an approval from Defense Office of Prepublication and Security Review… I certainly viewed some things with my own eyes but I can’t give too much details yet.’ Obviously, I am skeptical and I don’t believe everything I’m told, but I was amazed that the “hearsay” stuff about David Grusch was spreading so much. One can’t be so categorical for now.”
Lue Elizondo: Responding to someone saying Grusch has no firsthand info: “You are wrong. You don’t know the full story.”
Chris Mellon: “I’ve known Dave Grusch for years, and can say without hesitation that he is sincere, authentic, and someone who most certainly deserves a fair hearing. The leads he and others are providing should enable an interested Congress to determine the truth regarding longstanding allegations of recovered alien tech. I look forward to the hearing and hope that members and their staff are preparing thoughtful questions given the unprecedented nature of this opportunity.”
- Lue responded: “Chris, you are 100% correct. I know Grusch personally and he’s an American treasure. I fully expect the system to react to him the same way it did me. But don’t be fooled. He is exactly who he says he is. Americans and the world have a right to know!”
Garry Nolan: “Congress and the Senate are doing this SCIENTIFICALLY. They are starting with the base facts, the original people/pilots who came forward that got this going. As we are all aware, the public— and many politicians and media— are not up to speed. At the very least they seek validation. This is the validation process. Graves and Fravor are the ‘data’. David Grusch has provided data publicly and behind closed doors. Congresspeople (Luna and Burchett) provided real-time evidence this morning of DOD obstruction. Graves and Fravor and Lue Elizondo all came forward because they felt the subject matter was not being taken seriously. We begin the process (again) next week. Educating the public, and helping our politicians understand the landscape because THEY ACT ON OUR BEHALF.”
UFO Jesus/Post Disclosure World: “For those disappointed by the three people testifying at the upcoming UFO hearing, you have to recognize that this has never happened before. Instead of DoD bureaucrats that seemingly have no interest to be transparent to the public on UFOs, we’re getting direct witnesses that aren’t trying to spin anything. It’s a huge deal. The media will cover it. And this will likely inspire others to come forward with their stories. This isn’t the last hearing. But this is very important. And should lead to better things down the road.”
- He wondered if the witnesses would be sworn in, and a spokeswoman for the oversight committee said “all witnesses are sworn in prior to delivering their testimony.”
Lue Elizondo: “Friends, to allay any concerns, Chris and I are still very much in the fight. This is now the second hearing of many to come. There is a time, place, and purpose for everything we do. In the meantime, let’s be thankful for the courage of Congresspersons Burchette and Luna for their historic efforts!”
Chris Mellon: “I think one of the outcomes of this hearing will be that Congress will come to understand the necessity of a Congressionally-led investigation to bridge the chasm between whistleblower allegations and AARO’s denials. A good start would be for Congress to ask the IC IG what info it has already uncovered.”
Ross Coulthart: “Here’s someone in the DOD who can shed light on the UAP mystery whom Congress should publicly question under oath. More names to come.”
- Links to Randolph R Stone, assistant inspector general for evaluations of space, intelligence, engineering, and oversight.
- Reddit pointed out this guy was responsible for all DOD audit functions at one point, and oversaw those functions.
- Black Vault previous submitted a FOIA request for all his emails pertaining to UAP, and they were heavily censored.
Dr Sean Kirkpatrick, interviewed by ABC News:
- “We’ve interviewed almost 30 individuals who have come in to provide their testimony. And out of all of those, none of it has yet led to any verifiable information that substantiates the claim that the U.S. government has those ships or has a reverse engineering program either in the past or currently,”
- He downplayed the possible existence of a secret program that he is not privy to, saying, “Nothing has been denied us.”
- Ross Coulthart responded that Schumer believes “The executive branch was concealing important information regarding UAPs over broad periods of time.”
- “A number of these [whistleblowers] believe and have stated — and we believe them now — that they have seen something. And we are investigating.”
“Liberation Times understands that key representatives in the U.S. Congress are aware of smoking gun evidence, which has compelled them to act. The momentum is now almost unstoppable. Next week, there will be a dramatic Public Hearing within the House Oversight Committee’s Subcommittee on National Security, the Border, and Foreign Affairs. At that Hearing, expect new revelations. Expect anger. Expect an escalation in rhetoric from political representatives who are ready for a fight with unelected bureacrats.”

References

Video: Rep. Burchett and colleagues hold press conference on upcoming Oversight Committee hearing on UAPs
Rep. Burchett: “I don’t believe they can keep their thumb in the dam much longer.”
Rep. Luna: “The Pentagon answers to the people and thus Congress”
Rep. Moskowitz: “Disclosure is coming!”
Exoacademian: “This is not your imagination.”
Dr Kirkpatrick: “We believe [the whistleblowers] have seen something.”
Gaël Lombart: “It’s not clear to me that Grusch has no firsthand info.”
Lue Elizondo: “You are wrong [that Grusch has no firsthand info].”
Lue Elizondo: “Chris and I are still very much in the fight.”
Chris Mellon: “Congress should ask the ICIG what it has uncovered.”
Lue Elizondo: “I know Grusch personally and he’s an American treasure.”
Ross Coulthart: “Here’s someone Congress should question under oath.”
Post Disclosure World: “For those disappointed… the media will cover it.”
Rep. Burchett: “We lost a witness because of Pentagon interference.”
Rep. Burchett: “Why is the intelligence community blocking my amendment?”
Yankeenate: “From a certain point of view, both Burchett & McGovern are correct.”
Rep. Burchett: “We were denied access to footage.”
Debrief: Pentagon Official Warns of Potential Threat From Extraterrestrial “Technical Supremacy” as UAP Hearing Approaches
Mick West: “Witnesses have told their story before. What will we get from this hearing?”
Garry Nolan: “Congress is doing this scientifically. This is the validation process.”
Oversight Committee: “All witnesses are sworn in prior to delivering testimony.”
NASA: “NASA was not requested to participate in the UAP hearing.”
Mid Bay News: Members of Congress Lambast Eglin General Over UFO Information
Rep. Luna: “The level of backtracking from the Pentagon is unreal.”
Matt Gaetz: “I have seen evidence of craft that I am not familiar with.”
Liberation Times: As UFO Momentum Accelerates, Something Has To Give

Episode 23, posted on July 24, 2023